Curse

Teklord · Sep 15, 2005, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Probably obvious where I stand from previous posts I've made.

/signed with permanent ink.

Down with Twinkies! There is a very special place in Hell for all Twinkies.

zehly · Sep 15, 2005, 09:31 PM // 21:31

/signed

Just let me go in every once in a while to have fun please?

Lebdan · Sep 15, 2005, 10:06 PM // 22:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by zehly

/signed

Just let me go in every once in a while to have fun please?

Not hard to get a new rpg char to level 10 and use the skills from the ascalon area. =P

/signed for the second time

No one will notice

Whispering Siren · Sep 15, 2005, 10:20 PM // 22:20

/signed... (obviously, i'm the OP, of course i'd sign, but hey, why not sign again?)

johnnylange · Sep 15, 2005, 10:29 PM // 22:29

I say if you can't beat'em...join'em! There's nothing stopping you from getting the best armor, elite skills, and all that good stuff at an early level too. It's survival of the fittest, you can sit around and rant about it to hell and back or you can get up and do something about it! Take your pick...

Teklord · Sep 15, 2005, 10:34 PM // 22:34

"If you can't beat'em...join'em!"

This sits right up there with.

"But I was just following orders!"

And last I checked that didn't fly very well, or at all. A person is responsible for their own choices, and I (with many others I presume) prefer not to sink that low and to find a more realistic and acceptable solution.

johnnylange · Sep 15, 2005, 10:36 PM // 22:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teklord

"If you can't beat'em...join'em!"

This sits right up there with.

"But I was just following orders!"

And last I checked that didn't fly very well, or at all. A person is responsible for their own choices, and I (with many others I presume) prefer not to sink that low and to find a more realistic and acceptable solution.

I guess that means I'll be kicking your can in PvP then.

Teklord · Sep 15, 2005, 10:38 PM // 22:38

That a negative. I don't play lower level arenas, not until such a day comes when they are functional.

Oy, twinkies! <shudders>

zehly · Sep 15, 2005, 10:44 PM // 22:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lebdan

Not hard to get a new rpg char to level 10 and use the skills from the ascalon area. =P

/signed for the second time

No one will notice

I'm talking about EVIL fun.. I'm talking about:

(1) Ranger -> Punishing Shot
(2) Monk -> Shield of Judgement
(3) Elementalist -> Mind Shock
(4) Warrior -> Cleave
(5) Mesmer -> Energy Drain
(6) Necromancer -> Spiteful Spirit

... not that I've ever done this or anything... PM me for builds.

Almighty Zi · Sep 15, 2005, 10:45 PM // 22:45

I hate the 'if you cant beat em join em' attitude. Basically, if the trend continues then the lower level arenas will consist of two types of players - those who have played the game for a length of time and have twinked a new character, and players new to the game who know nothing about droknar's armour, forge runs or have any idea about the higher level skills and are there just wanting to try out PVP. Obviously, the new players are not going to be able to compete with the more experienced/twinked players and their first experience of PVP will be less than enjoyable. Consider the implications that this will have on the PVP game as a whole.

I vote for Armour and skill restrictions on lower level arenas as the only way to fix the problem.

jdwoody · Sep 16, 2005, 02:03 PM // 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnnylange

I guess that means I'll be kicking your can in PvP then.

That is doubtful, there are probably alot of people here who don't have low-level characters anymore and you obviously can't compete in the upper level arenas or you wouldn't be a twinkie.

-malachi- · Sep 16, 2005, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdwoody

That is doubtful, there are probably alot of people here who don't have low-level characters anymore and you obviously can't compete in the upper level arenas or you wouldn't be a twinkie.

yeah, I think it is sad too that those who can't do well in the real arenas or HoH simply go "bully" people in the low level arenas, which were designed to have a bit of fun while you were getting to level 20.

Isis Snowflame · Sep 16, 2005, 03:06 PM // 15:06

Yes and No guys. I think the cap needs to be put on the arenas themselves..IE like a message popping up saying sorry you cant enter while wearing / using blank. I dont like the idea of level dependant armors which is a big part of why I LEFT ff11. Let the guys with their fancy armors play with the henchies all they want in the missions. Theyre not hurting anyone. I took 2 characters through to ascension proper and now Im trying out different classes to see how they play through the game. Im enjoying the story so they've been rushed and have droks armor at level 7. Now Im playing back through it mostly on my own or helping new players without the high risk to myself. But they dont compete in the arena. I solo most things so basically please dont nerf my fun. There can be a happy medium for both parties here.

Cheers

Evisicator · Sep 16, 2005, 03:19 PM // 15:19

What you all are forgetting is that who cares if you have an elite you still only have 10 lvls worth of attribute points to allocate so they are not very strong at that point(maybe an extra 15 if you are really good at getting run and do the quest in the desert for the 15 attribute points like I did :P), they are just basically energy efficent at that point. Also there are pleanty of skills that do damage by bypassing armor. SO having AL60 armor doesnt matter anyways.

Sofonisba · Sep 16, 2005, 03:49 PM // 15:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evisicator

What you all are forgetting is that who cares if you have an elite you still only have 10 lvls worth of attribute points to allocate so they are not very strong at that point(maybe an extra 15 if you are really good at getting run and do the quest in the desert for the 15 attribute points like I did :P), they are just basically energy efficent at that point. Also there are pleanty of skills that do damage by bypassing armor. SO having AL60 armor doesnt matter anyways.

So, really, you are saying there is no tangible benefit to having max armor or elites in the lower-level arena.

If there is no tangible benefit then these twinkies won't miss them if there are restrictions to using them, right?

BUT, that premise is crap and you know it.

When a necro uses life siphon + life transfer + parasitic bond or whatever piled on you in Ascalon, no matter if they are only a level 4, you are done for.

When a ranger uses poison arrow + poison arrow + poison arrow, is there a counter to that at that point?

When you are a ranger with all your points maxed in marksmanship, and you are doing 0-1 damage to a warrior with Drok's armor, is that right? Is that proper?

I think not. I'll say it again: If there is no benefit to using max armor/elite skills, then those using them won't miss them.

lord_guru32 · Sep 16, 2005, 04:33 PM // 16:33

double signed i totaly agree with you as pvp is a major part of my play ( i quite enjoy low lvl pvp arenas )

Wyldchild777 · Sep 16, 2005, 04:55 PM // 16:55

Well, read through this thread and decided to add some of my own logic(?) to it.

How about:

The arenas being tied to the areas your character has been to? aka - If your character has made it to North Shiverpeaks, the Ascalon arena is now locked out. Made it to Kryta? Ascalon and North Shiverpeaks is now locked out.

Admittedly, I've only made it as far as Maguuma, and have not participated in PvP, but wouldn't this idea work pretty well?

And, oh btw - /signed. This issue seems to be in need of some addressing.

Merry meet, merry met, merry meet again.
Wyldchild

infernal · Sep 16, 2005, 05:15 PM // 17:15

/signed
/bumped

Some really great posts here with a sprinkling of 'flame-bait'!
I've really enjoyed this thread.

And.. yes, I agree.. Once a toon has crossed a threshold/checkpoint, they should not be admitted to the lower level arena. Rush all you like, get the best armor and pwn the crap outta titans or w/e, but taking that stuff back to Ascalon is a sure cry-for-help!
Admit it! You're crippled and you need that crutch so bad because without it everyone will see you for the poor player you are.

What can be learned in the lower levels to prepare you for the upper levels?
If you've been doing this awhile, you'll probably learn things about flanking characters, why you shouldn't run (criticals anyone?), better casting orders to maximize effects as well as good experimentation with introductory skill builds.

Throw elites and droks armor into the mix, and kiss that opportunity goodbye on both sides. Maybe that's why there are so many noobs in the upper arenas;-)

Infernal

Sofonisba · Sep 16, 2005, 05:38 PM // 17:38

True - by using the max armor/elite skills, everyone gets cheated!

No one will find out whether they are a good player, until level 20 arenas--because the rusher has an unfair advantage, and the non-rusher has an unfair disadvantage-- and it skews everyone's perception of their own abilities.

Moskel · Sep 16, 2005, 07:32 PM // 19:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sofonisba

So, do you support restrictions on that arena as suggested in this thread-- or, are you just posting to describe how hopelessly boring it is to ruin other people's playing experience by winning flawless 40 in a row in a low-level arena?

I'm not really sure its worth the coding effort to put restrictions on the arena, I'm with the 'if you can't beat them, join them crowd'. If you want to play on more even footing pick a pre-made PvP only character and go to the Random Arena.

PvE is bring what you've got, should you also restrict somebody from doing Great Northern Wall with a max damage weapon, max armor and superior runes? Is it fair to the other people in the party then since they are being helped or does that also ruin their gameplay experience since the mission is a trivial joke instead of a fun challenge?

It only takes roughly 20 hours to play through far enough to get real skills and good enough armor that you can play, sure maybe its not in the Ascalon Arena anymore, maybe its in Yak's Bend now (is that arena still there? I don't PvE much these days).